National - 000 011 010 000 000 - 3 13 4MVP: J.D. Drew (2-for-4, 2-run HR, BB, SB)
American - 000 000 210 000 001 - 4 14 1
Terry Francona:
[Drew] might have been a little more of an MVP if we went a couple more innings. He might have pitched. He's been begging me a long time to pitch, and we almost got close.The game lasted 4:50 -- the longest ASG by time -- ending at 1:37 AM. It matched the National League's 1967 victory -- 2-1 win in 15 innings.
When I was a kid, the American League never won an All-Star Game, losing 11 in a row from 1972 to 1982 (and dropping 19 of 20 dating back to 1963 and 24 of 26 (!) from 1960-1982). Since 1997, the AL is undefeated, going 10-0-1.
Am I suffereing amnesia, or was this clearly the best All-Star Game since Rose flattened poor Ray Fosse? And a big stuff it to the media types always bitching about the home field pay-off. I'll never forget (or forgive) the way Torre and Brenly managed the 2002 game as if nobody was keeping score, and then ran out of players like it was a shock to them that baseball has extra innings. Last night's game was really played hard, and it showed. Best of all, the Sox will have home field advantage in the Series.
ReplyDeleteThat said, I thought Francona was recklessly burning off pitchers when he didn't need to, especially since he couldn't use Kazmir for many innings. You have to keep a starter in reserve who can do what Aaron Cook did...I had assumed that role would fall to Iron Man Halliday. Sherrill really saved Tito's ass---the Sox should send him a ham or something.
Jack, it was the best ASG in my memory. But I confess that I went to sleep at midnight....I was delighted to wake up this morning and learn that the AL had won and the Drew was the MVP.
ReplyDeleteI hear the Daily News, following up its Papelbon story, is reporting that the National League won the All-Star Game 13-0 and the game was stopped after seven innings due to excessive rain.
ReplyDeleteI hear the Daily News, following up its Papelbon story, is reporting that the National League won the All-Star Game 13-0 and the game was stopped after seven innings due to excessive rain.
ReplyDeleteWell, at least Papelbon never ended up pitching then. Didn't have to see all of that bullshit.
I love how most of the crowd left the game after Rivera was done pitching. Oh, no more Yankees left. Time to go home.
Ish...is that really true? The Yankee fans left? Amazing. Some fans.
ReplyDeleteHey Amy: most of the best stuff happened AFTER midnight!
tito did a great job. what do you exoect the guy to do?
ReplyDeletehe was trying to get everyone in, what if was their only All Star shot? jeez, people like to complain about anything.
UTLEY LIKE NY
ReplyDelete"BOO? FUCK YOU!"
Ish...is that really true? The Yankee fans left? Amazing. Some fans.
ReplyDeleteThroughout extra innings, FOX would pan around the ballpark and there were a lot of empty seats. So, I'm estimating 50/50, although fans in the outfield looked to have stuck around a bit.
Not one person said a word about people leaving, though.
tito did a great job. what do you exoect the guy to do?
ReplyDeletehe was trying to get everyone in, what if was their only All Star shot? jeez, people like to complain about anything.
Tied up in the top of the 9th in the all-star game is probably one of the harder parts to manage, because for all we know, Drew or someone could have hit a walk-off dong in bottom half.
I'd say Mariano should have had the entire 9th, give K-Rod the 10th, etc. etc. etc. That way you can wait until the 16th to use Kazmir, haha.
And then the 17th or 18th to use Drew.
ReplyDeleteI recognize that he has a lot to balance, but the priorities are, in order:
ReplyDelete1) Winning the Game
2) Putting on a good show
3) Not embarrassing the sport
4) Getting as many players into the game as possible.
If Tito lost the game ( or had another tie) because he was working so hard to get everyone in the game (there is no rule or requirement of this, you know), then he BY DEFINITION would not have done a "great job," now would he?
And essentially it was just dumb luck that that didn't happen. If the game had ended with J.D. Drew pitching, would you say the manager---that is, the guy chraged with making sure his talent is allocated properly---did a great job? Bullshit.
Back in the '80's, one All Star Game ended with the AL team having the tying run in scoring position with two outs in the 9th as a pitcher made the final out. Why? Because idiot manager Jim Frey didn't save any pinch-hitters, as he he was concentrating on getting "everybody into the game." Well, the All-Star Game is for the fans, not the players, and it's still supposed to be a baseball game, not just a parade of stars. This obsession with always getting every single player in is fairly recent, and makes no sense.
The AL won, and thus Tito's wasting of several pitchers (K-Rod for just two outs?) didn't hurt. But it still was losusy planning.
Agreed Nixon. The guy wanted to give everyone who came a chance to play. It was really the nicest thing he could do.
ReplyDeleteTito always sweeps the WS anyways, so the home field advantage is moot. ;)
jack, hurdle was in pretty much the same situation. both managers were an inning away from position layers pitching. its the way the game is supposed to mean something, while also making sure everyone gets in there, is what is at fault.
ReplyDeletewith all the bullshit he has to juggle, he did a fine job.
if we win the world series AGAIN, i cant wait to hear what you'll complain about.... yawn.
Tito always sweeps the WS anyways, so the home field advantage is moot. ;)
ReplyDeleteIn that case, you want the NL to have HFA so you can win Game 4 at Fenway.
That's what I want to see next.
Players always talk about what a thrill it is to go to an ASG, the main thing a manager should do is make sure everyone plays.
ReplyDeleteWin the game? Who cares?
It's an exhibition game.
It means nothing.
WS home field is more Selig bullshit, nothing more than his lame attempt to make the ASG relevant.
if we win the world series AGAIN, i cant wait to hear what you'll complain about.... yawn.
ReplyDeleteFrancona's pitching decision in the 7th inning of Game 4 of the ALDS was beyond stupid. Shades of Pinky Higgins. God knows how this team keeps winning with this jackass at the helm.
(this can also be considered part of the parody thread)
the other argument is that the team with the best record should have home field advantage, but i dont agree with that 100% either. since our team is coming from the best division in baseball, we have a tougher schedule than any NL team. the weaker league team could end up with a better record, and that still isnt 100% fair. its an interesting subject for sure.
ReplyDeleteThis game was managed more for where they were, than anything else.....imagine if k-rod, after that first out gets the next guy to bounce into a double play...and the home team won in the bottom of the inning and Mo never got in........he should have for Pap's sake switched K-rod's and paps role ...that way he wouldn't have got so much shit......
ReplyDeleteNixon's objection to the "best record" method is dead on. But alternating home advantage was a real non-solution.
ReplyDeleteUsing the All-Star Game to determine home-field advantage WORKS---it improves the game, clearly, obviously. I am completely bewildered by Allan's argument that getting everyone in the game trumps the result....again, the game is for the fans, it's a competition, and some people (like me) actually care about the result, especially after all those years of seeing the AL lose. Who the hell cares whether some player gets to play an inning in the game? Managers don't use sentiment to decide who's on the field in a World Series...well, managers other than Johnny Mac.
The original idea of the All-Star Game was to have two superteams battle for supremacy of the leagues, and the best line-ups tended to stay pretty much intact the whole game. ESPN's #1 All-Star Game moemnt was Ted Willims' walk-off home run to win the game in 1946. Well, if Tito had been managing, Williams would have been lifted for some St. Louis Browns outfielder by the 5th inning.
The players on the bench used to be honored just to be named. Typically three or four starters and one or two relievers pitched. And you didn't have extra-inning games where all the suspense was over whether the managers would run out of players. If the All-Star game is so pointless, why do the players care if they actually play?
The point is the competition.
I agree---there is an inherent conflict in trying to satisfy the players' desire to be in the game and the fan's desire to not have the game end in an infuriating tie after watching the damn thing for four hours. Well, the fans count more.
I am completely bewildered by Allan's argument that getting everyone in the game trumps the result
ReplyDeleteIt's a meaningless exhibition. Like a spring training game. That's it. It's not hard to understand.
some people (like me) actually care about the result, especially after all those years of seeing the AL lose
There has not been separate AL and NL offices for many years. Inter-league play has destroyed any kind of separation between the two leagues. This is one time I feel justified in saying it's not like it used to be.
Who the hell cares whether some player gets to play an inning in the game?
Well, for starters, "some player" might.
Managers don't use sentiment to decide who's on the field in a World Series...well, managers other than Johnny Mac.
Suddenly, the ASG is the same as a WS game. How did that happen?
the best line-ups tended to stay pretty much intact the whole game. ... if Tito had been managing, Williams would have been lifted for some St. Louis Browns outfielder by the 5th inning.
Look at the rosters of the ASG from the 50s. Starters were often gone in the 5th.
I guess that's Tito's fault too. Even though he was born in 1959.
Move over MBM, SASAHE and WOTS. Make some roomf or IATF:
It's All Tito's Fault
actually on second thought, you're right Jack. tito was terrible. he should have seen into the future that the game was going to last 15 innings. what was he thinking?!
ReplyDeletehe should have picked wakefield to the roster to eat up those innings he'd foreseen in his crystal ball, or crystal bald head for that matter!
youre right, he' too much of a "players manager" and respects the game way too much to try and give his guys on the all star team, some of whom this was probably their only shot to make it to the team, a chance to get into the game. the nerve!
He should be outlawed from next year's ASG as manager after we win the WS in '08. I hope bud selig is going to fine both managers for their actions last night. makes me think a strike should be coming. This just cannot be tolerated!
in all seriousness, i'm sure the played CARE about whether they get in the game or not.
ReplyDelete"crystal bald head"
ReplyDelete:>)
I actually stayed up all night watching...somewhere in my little brain hoping Drew and Wright would actually pitch...It was entertaining you can't argue that.There were some great plays some great clutch fielding some great clutch pitching and some great clutch hitting.oh yeah and also Dan Uggla...No one wanted to lose it was hard to watch that game and believe the players actually thought it was only an exhibition.
ReplyDeleteI would refute some of these choice comments, but Allan, 9C and especially Nix have taken care of it already. Funny how Jack's not telling them their argument style is pathetic, or chastising them for sarcasm. Why is that, I wonder...
ReplyDeletehe was trying to get everyone in, what if was their only All Star shot? jeez, people like to complain about anything.
ReplyDeleteIndeed.
The ASG is utterly meaningless in terms of winning or losing. I like when the AL wins, but I also recognize it's totally meaningless.
But for the players, it's an honour to be there. I think it would suck to be named to the team, but not get to play.
The players on the bench used to be honored just to be named.
That's an assumption, of course. We don't know what those players were thinking. And if they're asked, of course they're going to say that - it doesn't mean they felt any different than players do now.
Back in my day... Hey you kids get off my lawn... Tito is moronic... Oops, how'd that get in there?
I think if the ASG is supposed to "count" in any way, then it should be a true all-star team, made up of the actual best players in each league. No fan voting (popularity contest), no requirement that every team be represented.
ReplyDeleteBut OTOH, if you are going to stick with fan voting and requirements about team representation, then that it's an exhibition game, just for fun, nothing more, nothing less.
You don't set it up as a fun, exhibition-only game, then put something real (WS HFA) at stake.
Not that I think HFA is so important, just the idea of an exhibition game determining anything in a WS is wrong.
To me it should be one or the other. MLB tries to split it down the middle, and as usual, gets it completely wrong.
I'll never forget (or forgive) the way Torre and Brenly managed the 2002 game
ReplyDeleteSeriously? You can't forgive the way an ASG was managed?
Man, you might even out-do Allan in the grudge department. Even if we're only talking in context of baseball, this would hardly seem to rise to the level of unforgiveable.
L-girl said...
ReplyDeleteI'll never forget (or forgive) the way Torre and Brenly managed the 2002 game
Seriously? You can't forgive the way an ASG was managed?
Good Point.I think the only ones who really cared lived in Vegas.
There are quite of few people out there who don't think of it as an "exhibition " if you can bet on it.
And with Jack always harping on Tito....Maybe my history is wrong but results make him the greatest manager in Red Sox history.
Maybe my history is wrong but results make him the greatest manager in Red Sox history.
ReplyDeleteYour history is correct.
It'd be interesting to see the ASG be an actual game, properly played. Shorten the rosters - have 25 men on each team available, have a starter on regular rest pitch...Have an actual bullpen, etc. Or have the top two or three starting pitchers split six or seven innings, then have a couple of set-up men, a closer, the lot.
ReplyDeleteHave a starting 9, a couple of infield bench guys, a fourth and fifth outfielder, another catcher. So maybe you do have guys who play all nine innings. Superteam AL vs. Superteam NL.
I wish the game didn't count for anything, or that people didn't care so that the players would goof off and do silly things (aka have fun). Like in the basketball all-star game the players just try to do crazy dunks and shit. That's how it should be. That's how I see it, anyways.
ReplyDeleteHow disarming would it be if a pitcher all of a sudden decided to lob and underhand toss to a hitter (or some crazy behind the back gyroball)? I think that would be a lot more fun that getting pissed off at Tito for throwing away our chances of WS HFA.
The culture of baseball is disappointing sometimes.
Funny how the 9 batters who played the majority of the game were for the AL... Drew, Young, Quentin, Guillen, Sizemore, Longoria, Morneau, Kinsler, and Navarro. That's quite the interesting lineup. Most of them actually had 5 plate appearances.
ReplyDeleteNL: Tejada, Uggla, Gonzalez, Wright, Guzman, Hart, Ludwick, McClouth, and Martin. How about a team with those two lineups playing a game against each other? That was one of the things that made last night as fun as it was.
I wish the game didn't count for anything, or that people didn't care so that the players would goof off and do silly things (aka have fun).
ReplyDeleteI do too! It would be *fun*, which is what it should be.
Anybody remember John Kruk's AB against Randy Johnson in... ??? what year was that? After taking two completely over-matched swings, he stepped out of the batter's box, turned his helmet the other way, stepped into the other side - right-handed batter's box, even though he hit left - and swung away. It was so funny!
Superteam AL vs. Superteam NL.
This would be great fun, in its way, too. But it would be so unfair to contending teams. Who wants their pitcher to throw an extra game, maybe not be able to make his next start? Or if a key player got hurt?
That's why even though it would be cool to see, it can't be done that way.
Which means that's why the whole thing should just be a fun exhibition game, period.
That was 1993.
ReplyDeleteWe feel old!
Anybody remember John Kruk's AB against Randy Johnson in... ??? what year was that? After taking two completely over-matched swings, he stepped out of the batter's box, turned his helmet the other way, stepped into the other side - right-handed batter's box, even though he hit left - and swung away. It was so funny!
ReplyDeleteI liked it when Carlos Zambrano threw a curve over Manny's head last night and Manny came up smiling.
You guys are right. What'll Bud think of next? Making Spring Training games count?
That was 1993.
ReplyDeleteMy dad always tells me that story. I was five, so I didn't watch, nor did I care. I was busy being five.
JoS is very intergenerational. :)
ReplyDeleteseriously if drew had pitched i would have dumped jacoby. i really would have.
ReplyDeleteL-girl said...
ReplyDeleteSuperteam AL vs. Superteam NL.
This would be great fun, in its way, too. But it would be so unfair to contending teams. Who wants their pitcher to throw an extra game, maybe not be able to make his next start? Or if a key player got hurt?
Yeah , you can't forget this is these guys jobs.......I still can't find any fault in the game I watched last night.....what it should be or what it once was it is still entertainment.we as fans sometimes take it all too seriouslly.
SoSHer thrawnqq:
ReplyDelete"After 2 decades of Yankee fans dismissing our 'rivalry' as a figment of Red Sox fans imagination, last night was validation that the Yankee Fans have become bitter, angry and pathetic. ... I loved every minute of it. And I am quite sure the Sox players did too."
jeter talked tito's ear off towards the end. I hate jeter. Tito may have the flu now. Jeter is a terrorist.
ReplyDeletei love baseball, that is all.
ReplyDelete