January 6, 2006

Could Tejada Replace Manny?

Since "Zenslinger" and I agree on quite a bit regarding The Manny Debate, I don't want this to sound like an attack, but near the end of his comment here, he wrote that Ramirez:
can only be replaced by Tejada, he of the 150 RBIs. Anything less won't do, including the same value spread across several players.
Miguel Tejada is no slouch with the stick, but it's important to remember that Manny Ramirez is many levels above him. He has been so consistent that we sometimes forget how incredible his performances have been, year in and year out.
OPS+ (100 is league avg.)

Manny Tejada

1993 33
1994 124
1995 148
1996 145
1997 143 50
1998 146 78
1999 174 91
2000 185 112
2001 162 112
2002 190 122
2003 160 117
2004 152 126
2005 156 133

Car. 156 112
What else?

Tejada's career-high batting average is .311 -- Manny has topped that 5 times (including .351 and .349).

Tejada's career-high on-base average is .360 -- Manny has topped that 11 times (every year he's been a full-time player).

Tejada's career-high slugging average is .534 -- Manny has topped that 11 times (every year he's been a full-time player).

Tejada's career-high Runs Created is 125 -- Manny has topped that 8 times, tied it once, and had 124 RC in another season.

Tejada career-high OPS is .894 -- Manny has posted an OPS over 1.000 6 times, over .900 11 times; indeed, his career OPS is 1.008.

Based on their career numbers, a team of 9 Mannys would score 9.02 runs a game; 9 Tejadas would score 5.62 runs.

I could go on all night ... but I'll just repeat the OBP and SLG comparisions:

Tejada's career-high on-base average is .360 -- Manny has topped that 11 times (every year he's been a full-time player).

Tejada's career-high slugging average is .534 -- Manny has topped that 11 times (every year he's been a full-time player).

Honestly, it ought to be a crime to say these two guys are anywhere near equals at the plate.


Jim M said...

I have to agree. As far as hitters there is no way that in ANY 1 to 1 trade the Sox would get equal value for Manny. He is quite simply one of top, if not "the" top hitter in the game.
I think that if a trade is made it will be because the Sox management will just have grown too weary of the annual sideshow that has become Manny and they will fear that someday he actually will walk away and leave them in a lurch.
Go Sox
Jim M

Donald said...

Very thorough comparison, thanks redsock. To be fair, Miguel is definitely a leader and a soldier, but I have always said that a straight up trade would benefit the O's more than us, only we are rather understaffed at shortstop, and since Manny wanted out and Tejada wanted in...
But that's all changed now, so I'm happy we're keeping Manny!

Zenslinger said...

Wow, I would have said Manny was only slightly superior. I stand corrected. Nice to get education.

redsock said...

In fairness, I'll post a link to David Gassko's article at The Hardball Times, which, after taking fielding and position into account, says Tejada is better.

DanM said...

Tejada better than Manny because of defense? Paleeze! Lets get a shortstop and get to Florida - Clement included.

The American League East is a tough place to be - and Toronto will learn that anew this summer!

DanM said...

I read this quote in the Herald this morning
" There is no black and white this time of year. Comments from Tejada, Ramirez and the Red Sox front office can’t be taken at face value even if they do wind up becoming reality.
Alex Cora is receiving a lot of love from the Red Sox front office these days. The brain trust has placed the infielder’s on-field smarts above any other’s in the game. "
(Patience preached on Yawkey Way
By Michael Silverman)
I guess that leaves center field and lead-off hitter. So, who is going to lead off (Youk?) Nahhhh

Minsane said...

The only reason I disagree is because you're not taking into account relative value based on position (or some sort of VORP weighting). Even ignoring Manny's atrocious defense, if we make the dubious assumption that both players are equally good at their respective positions, it's easy to see that the offensive value that Manny adds (say in terms of OBP and SLG) is reduced by the fact that the Sox can find a replacement left fielder who can put up much better numbers than their replacement SS (Alex Cora).

I can't pretend that the average dumbass sportswriter is taking into account this factor when they claim that Manny and Tejada are equally good hitters- that being said, I think the argument is there that they're fairly equivalent for their positions, i.e. (Manny - avg. OF) is roughly equivalent to (Tejada - avg. SS).

Throw in the facts that the FA and trade pools are much better for non-CF OFs than SS, that Tejada plays much better defense than Manny, that Manny is a big crybaby, and that Tejada is much cheaper than Manny, and I for one would much rather have Tejada than Manny.

Also, in theory, I would think it'd be easier for the Sox to slot in someone like Marte (or Lowell) into LF than into SS.

So I'm game for the trade. That being said I don't think I'd do it if I were the O's. Maybe if the Sox equalized their salaries.

I Hate the Sox more than Hitler said...

Guys I apologize, I realize sometimes young kids could read these comments.
have a good season

Devine said...

Whereas Miguel "Trade me! Don't trade me! I never wanted to be traded! Trade me!" Tejada is totally sane? I mean, isn't that pretty much EXACTLY what Manny has done?

Mind you, I'm SURE he's much less of a headcase than Manny, but uh, you know, he's not completely all right and if you're an Orioles fan, his conduct has to be considered pretty bitchy (as does Manny's for Sox fans).

Tejada and a decent outfielder (.275+ avg, average or better defense) for Manny...that would be understandable. Even throw in one of the lesser starting pitchers with Manny and I can still (sort of) understand the rationale (and this is coming from someone who loves Manny). But I don't know about a one-to-one trade. You gain a lot of defense, but you lose one of the best hitters in the game.

And don't all of Manny's assists (especially when he threw out Jeter at the end of last year for the first out of the final game) count for anything? (The previous remark was mostly a joke.)

Jack Marshall said...

Kudos to "hitler' for a classy exit (I can't believe I just wrote that.)

Devine: Tejada's yo-yo act is indeed exactly like Manny's, with one huge difference ...this is his first trade me demand and not his, what, 219th?

But all this is clearly a dead issue, right? I can't imagine the Sox wasting any more precious time getting rid of their best hitter if it means weakening the team one iota or adding to an already unsettling situation.